An Attempt at a Sorc 17er - Game Thread

[Zugzwang]

@Zugzwang

anyway

ngl i need to stop using anyway so much
like i’m not changing the topic i’m just saying something

[lol]

@Zugzwang

If you start making posts with reasoning about why others are town/scum then you might look towny

have done that so far, im not one to make cases so if that’s what you’re looking for you’re out of luck

[Zorvo]

@baker

then at least 1 in Arctic or Arete has to be wolf and other villager.

We could vote Arctic.

@baker

t!Zorvo is a strong solver D1

Not all the time.

[Zorvo]

@baker

Anyway Zorvo, you better start playing or I am not moving my vote

Isn’t this FM?

[Zorvo]

@tutuu

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XisJD8V1Rqw&ab_channel=SherifDolan

mac
pidgeon (achro)
arctic
porscha
baker

icet
olivest
ybw

arete
geyde
jinxed

zorvo
apo
zug

guava
lol

Your reads Suck.

[Zorvo]

Actually it’s not too bad

[Zugzwang]

looked over your iso and I see a bit of that
but like
not a lot, not in depth, and there’s also some completely unexplained reads (like, why am I obvious town)

[Zugzwang]

@Zorvo

Your reads Suck.

@Zorvo

Actually it’s not too bad

what caused the change here?

[Apocryphal]

Yeah, it’s not too bad

I’m not sure who’d I’d drop in order to raise myself and you

Probably drop Olivest and YBW down, and then drop Jinxed further down?

Eh

Reads lists hard why do you think I just say who I like and who I don’t /jk

[tutuu]

@Arete if there’s any deep wolves I think it’s you

[IcetFeelsPain]

why is arctic town

[Apocryphal]

I like Arete’s posts, but I don’t really have that much of a reason to actually town read them beyond “Player I respect”

Would easily get snowed by them

[tutuu]

out of his scumrange thought by multiple people

really pure posts

really in-depth thought

easy to read if you just follow along his logic

past experience with him, he has done this every time as town

transparent

[tutuu]

you have 2 more posts just a heads up

[Apocryphal]

I know

[Apocryphal]

Nya

[Zorvo]

@IcetFeelsPain

why is arctic town

That’s a good question.

[Zorvo]

@tutuu

out of his scumrange thought by multiple people

How do we know this?

[tutuu]

know what?

a few people expressed so, mac did, i semi-jokingly did, i forgot who else

or if you’re asking what’s his scumrange - i dont know firsthand. my other points carry more weight to me, this point is more so a conclusion than a point

[Zorvo]

@Arctic

i feel like all of these can be explained by stuff i’ve already told you whether it be me taking a backseat, or me genuinely scumreading magnus (so i’m not sure why that’s even a point in the first place?)

the last point is like… okay yeah no i was going to sugarcoat it but this read just never works on me
like the last time someone tried to use this read on me was when Marl deathtunneled me at the start of valorant FM because i was deflated due to the way the game was going (and i even wanted to roll wolf that game)

my enjoyment of the game in recent times has become much more linked to how the game is going for my alignment rather than my alignment itself

@Arctic

@mollylikesorigami

may this game seems like a rough, sloppy caricature of may last game to me. otherwise idk, and arctic’s points don’t resonate with me at all tbh. sorry man but like, “you could’ve done something to save eliza” is real rich coming from you lmfao.

that was like a tangential part of my case against her
what are your thoughts on the main body (where the vote is)

@Marluxion

but also i do want you to explain why you think arete was town at this point

you won’t be happy to hear this but it was partly because i agreed with their eliza take at the time and partly because i think the way they steered away from zorvo to eliza felt villagery in the moment because if they were trying to make a push on zorvo in bad faith then turning around and shading people who are agreeing with you seems counterproductive to this, and it implies that arete was genuinely trying to solve the game rather than push in one direction

do you have reasons to suspect arete other than the eliza take

@Arctic

@Jarek

I can get behind that considering their last post was 2 days ago. I don’t think a wolf AFK’s like that though.

@Jarek

I’ve seen evils in other, shorter social deduction games go mute because they think it helps them fly under the radar to contribute absolutely nothing whilst the good team goes at eachother.

I didn’t think someone would try and pull that off here because a 48 hour gap of not posting is significantly more noticable than a 1-2 minute gap of not contributing anything to any particular day phase. I suppose with the chaos of these T/T wagons they might have felt safe doing so, but it’s hard to believe a wolf willingly does nothing instead of adding fuel to the fire.

this read is extremely dubious

have you considered that them disappearing may be due to unrelated reasons to the game rather than #strats and this does not affect their chances of being a wolf

do you have a read on their actual content

@Zorvo

Also now I think I want to put Arctic back into straight lean cause like I’m thinking about it and shouldn’t Arctic logically have disagreed with me and be voting otterpop with you but is instead voting May?

i don’t know what you’re saying i should be disagreeing with you about, but i have disagreed with you several times that otter was a villager wagon (though i am currently unsure at the moment) and the reason i am not voting them is because i think may is more wolfy and otter/may are probably not w/w

@Marluxion

@Arctic i am awake and want to talk about arete where are you
isn’t it like 4 pm in tealand

i already said that i don’t think your take on their eliza take is good because i townread it, and your point on aro’s question just feels like regardless of your alignment you are trying to spin that as wolf indicative for arete when it is a massive reach
ultimately i don’t know whether this is wolf AI or you are just confbiased because it’s just unnecessary but i do know it is

do you have thoughts on literally anyone else

@Arctic

@Arete

anyways people are going to hate this take but Vulgard townreading me is legitimately close to lock clearing for me (conditional on him being a villager which I am not yet certain of), like I’m not completely incapable of fooling him but it requires that I put basically all of my effort into optimizing for Trying To Fool Vulgard which is not a thing I would do if he weren’t even in the game

i was about to accuse this of being TMI and then i actually read the post
i don’t see why in order to fool vulgard you would have to specifically play to fool him, instead of just… having a good wolf game, or pulling it off unintentionally. regardless, i don’t care much about his read on you right now because i don’t have much of a read on him either

@Arete

even though his initial reasoning for suspecting Arctic was largely predicated on a false assumption

what reasoning are you referring to here?

@Arete

vague bitterness at myself for, yesterday, noticing midday that I was experiencing the specific sort of nervousness about the prospect of someone being a wolf that often means they are and I just don’t want them to be, and then ignoring that fact. which is stupid since he hasn’t even flipped yet, he could still be a villager!

@Arete

I don’t really have strong wolfreads, not even Arctic even if I do think it’s ~likely, which is – not great. Like it means I’m definitely Wrong On Someone but when I contemplate ‘actually fulfilling my basic responsibility to figure out who ’ it makes me want to close the thread and curl up with a blanket in my beanbag chair and play some online Pokemon. This is not really a great position to be in.

god damn. i’m not sure wolf arete can fake these posts, especially the first with TMI that i’m town (i am assuming it is referring to me given their earlier posts)

@Arctic

i am thinking about arete, seth. for instance i’ve been considering that the reason neither of me/you were nightkilled is because aro/neon were correct on other reads (such as May or otter) while you’ve been correct on Arete and i’ve been defending them from you, effectively nullifying your push there

the alternative i’m thinking about is that how if i follow my social read on Arete and the gamestate, May is probably just a wolf

consider how it makes sense for May to be masterminding the world where the three of me, you and Arete are villagers, and none of us are being nightkilled. i called it out on day 1, but i dropped it after i misread magnus for similar reasoning, but it holds that they’ve been egging on your (at least one incorrect) pushes since day 1

i think they’ve had two wolfy eods. i think they’ve been taking a backseat for most of the game while villagers kill each other and she’s never practically acted on any of her strong convictions in an impactful way. it doesn’t look like she’s trying to solve the game - it looks like she is playing in a calculated way to capitalize on whatever opportunity comes up, whether it be me at eod or Arete now and i don’t think her justification of voting me because my flip would be informative holds when i’ve been a hardly-discussed yet townread slot for the entire game. like, that’s the opposite of the sort of slot you want to kill for information, and they didn’t respond to my question about it either so i have to just take it at face value.

I think it’s extremely unlikely that otter and may contains zero wolves, and I would rather kill one of them today than Arete

@Arctic

if i die, i think arete and seth are v/v

i still think otter is likely mafia, and i think eliza is more likely to be town as well

i think phraze may be being miscleared

@tutuu