Stratagem-15 FM - MAFIA VICTORY

[Zugzwang]

@Psyx

Not sure why you feel the need to “give back” a TR/TL?

I often want to do this too fwiw

[Arctic]

I should probably talk about windy. I do wish we had more from her by now but I maintain that the way she’s approaching the game is less likely to be from a wolf. I think you can get to this answer by considering the nature of the setup and the importance of making an impression early. There are only 2 wolves in 11 players. Wolves need 4 misyeets to win - and there is a cop which may or may not be useful depending on how early the encryptor dies. I think the way she’s holding her cards close to her chest and refusing to co-operate is not conducive to making a good impression and laying an early foundation to avoid being investigated - this in itself makes me think she is probably not the encryptor, which already makes her less than rand likely to be a wolf, but I can extend this further by saying that I think she’s less likely to play this way as a wolf period simply because she isn’t trying to control the narrative, or spam posts, or get herself in a better position, etc. people are going to want to reduce this to TWTBAW but this sort of thing is very much real because I also identify with the approach. I think she would only be playing like this in order to stop like… specifically me from finding her as a wolf, but that’s much harder to believe than her just being a villager and feeling like she can do whatever she wants. the posts she is making are not the sort of posts that people will look back on in f5 or whatever and think “wow this is towny”

I have a godread on her but she has had a lot of games on the paywalled forum which I don’t have access to so if my godread were to be wrong due to a sudden change in playstyle it’d be pretty likely to be now but it’s lasted like 3 years since we started playing so it’s worth some consideration

i’ll hopefully have a more definitive answer by eod when she’s done more but yeah

@WindwardAway

@Caitlin

Agree here, especially ‘if I was town’ always pings me so so so much lol

If I were town, I would post a lot more

oh also, if this were true, I very much doubt she would actually post this as a wolf while she is lowposting lol (it’s not true though)

[guavagudetama]

@Luka

Unrelated, can I have a read list from you?

Yeah

Town
May
Psyx

TL
Arctic
lol
Abbi
Luka
Caitlin (would be null if Gar wasn’t scumreading this)

Null
Zugzwang

SL
Windward

Scum
Gar

[Arctic]

@guavagudetama explain why you townread caitlin

sorry if this is hypocritical given my recent posts, but it’s important

[guavagudetama]

Because I think Gar is scum and I doubt Gar is trying to buss Caitlin

[Garfooled]

I won’t be caught up in probably 5 hours but

1. Yes I didn’t see Arctics vote on Caitlin, I was still catching up
2. No I wouldn’t buss Caitlin, but I’m not scum
3. Guava just wants me to be scum, and it shows because they had other points on me earlier but now they’re just making their argument to be “it’s because Caitlin isn’t scum” because they forgot. Because they’re not actually scum hunting

[Caitlin]

@Arctic

I feel like me/luka/caitlin have a current dynamic that is going to be pretty damaging if the three of us are villagers. like, except for me and luka to each other, everyone in this group feels like the others should be reading them better than they are. and it’s kind of causing a vicious cycle of omgus. cait thinks i shouldn’t scumread her because i’ve seen her open badly as town. luka thinks cait shouldn’t scumread him given their experience together. i don’t think cait should be omgus’ing me because i’ve misread her before. and i feel like uh. it might be useful to take a step back at this point. it’s pretty clear that there isn’t going to be more than one wolf in this group anyway (although to you guys I guess you might think me and luka could be w/w, though I know that to be false) so I would suggest that all of us try and look elsewhere at least temporarily because I feel like none of us are likely to be reading the others objectively given how this has progressed

Townie post

How does one unvote

[Caitlin]

Guava is too sure of Gar to be mafia

Gar is p townie in the response too

And I see TvT sparks

[Caitlin]

Actually meh I won’t need to unvote I can just vote Luka instead

VOTE: Luka

[Caitlin]

Wait why is Guava voting Windward?

[Garfooled]

I don’t mind switching to either one of my bottom 4 btw
More hesitant on May because they make sense
But then again they brought up good points on me only after I quoted why I thought they were doing what they did as scum when they explained how they read Arctic as they did about me in my last game
They saw my quotations and had an “a-ha!” Moment in which they saw something to push me down with and pretend that was what they were going on about all along rather than something they came up with on the spot

[Garfooled]

Bottom 3*

[Caitlin]

Guava can you explain your Lol TL to me btw?

[guavagudetama]

@Garfooled

Guava just wants me to be scum, and it shows because they had other points on me earlier but now they’re just making their argument to be “it’s because Caitlin isn’t scum” because they forgot. Because they’re not actually scum hunting

Was I asked why you were scum or was I asked why Caitlin was town?
I was asked why Caitlin was town

You are scum because your push on Caitlin is awful, you voted her initially for asking Zugzwang how they know they’ll live to d2 and then you projected your own meta onto her

[guavagudetama]

@Caitlin

Guava can you explain your Lol TL to me btw?

It’s just vibes
I’ve played a few games with him and this feels like town lol
It’s nothing super concrete which is why it’s a lean

[Garfooled]

@guavagudetama

I was asked why Caitlin was town

Hold on really?
Hmmm
I’ll look

@guavagudetama

then you projected your own meta onto her

What’s wrong with that anyway?

[Caitlin]

@Arctic

I should probably talk about windy. I do wish we had more from her by now but I maintain that the way she’s approaching the game is less likely to be from a wolf. I think you can get to this answer by considering the nature of the setup and the importance of making an impression early. There are only 2 wolves in 11 players. Wolves need 4 misyeets to win - and there is a cop which may or may not be useful depending on how early the encryptor dies. I think the way she’s holding her cards close to her chest and refusing to co-operate is not conducive to making a good impression and laying an early foundation to avoid being investigated - this in itself makes me think she is probably not the encryptor, which already makes her less than rand likely to be a wolf, but I can extend this further by saying that I think she’s less likely to play this way as a wolf period simply because she isn’t trying to control the narrative, or spam posts, or get herself in a better position, etc. people are going to want to reduce this to TWTBAW but this sort of thing is very much real because I also identify with the approach. I think she would only be playing like this in order to stop like… specifically me from finding her as a wolf, but that’s much harder to believe than her just being a villager and feeling like she can do whatever she wants. the posts she is making are not the sort of posts that people will look back on in f5 or whatever and think “wow this is towny”

This is just a more wordy version of when I called Windy town for making enemies

[Caitlin]

@guavagudetama

It’s just vibes
I’ve played a few games with him and this feels like town lol
It’s nothing super concrete which is why it’s a lean

Hmmmm okay

I just feel like he is a slot ppl might be overlooking because he started posting late, which is why I figured I’d ask

[guavagudetama]

@Caitlin

Wait why is Guava voting Windward?

I’m not letting them vote me and then vote Luka and just not explain it at all
They were like “I’m not explaining this btw don’t bother asking” which is like. Very scummy imo

[Caitlin]

@guavagudetama

I’m not letting them vote me and then vote Luka and just not explain it at all
They were like “I’m not explaining this btw don’t bother asking” which is like. Very scummy imo

But almost TWTBAW

And you seem more sure on Gar