Stratagem-15 FM - MAFIA VICTORY

[Psyx]

Thoughts on players v2:

1. Arctic - not touching on D1 due to “holy townie light” buff post (#713)
2. Garfooled - no notable interactions aside from Guava and people don’t talk about them much, but they seem like they’re solving in their little corner. Hope I can see more progression on their reads since they seem to be stuck on Cait/Guava without taking new posts into consideration
3. Luka - still no wolf pings and their tone consistently sounds towny. I admit I haven’t been paying close attention to their posts after that early townlean tho; +1 ISO homework
4. PrincessAbigail - I’ve never ISO-ed PrincessAbigail in our previous games due to their post count and I’m not planning on starting that anytime soon. Waiting for a towntell from their slot
5. WindwardAway - their D1 wasn’t so hot during our game in NUF, so if they continue as is here I hope they’ll post better in D2 & D3 like in that game too
6. Caitlin - need to see their fleshed out readlist to tell if there’s any credible progression. Outside of their tunnel-y back-and-forth with Arctic/Luka they seem to be interacting with others just fine
7. guavagudetama - they feel stuck on Garfooled
8. May - not touching on D1. I don’t think I can trust any read I make on them so early into the game
9. Zugzwang - their case on me had decent initiative. Would like to see more posts from them
10. lol - don’t remember much from them

[May]

Hey chat, may I make a request? Please do keep in mind that you work with perfect information on your own actions and decisions. You have so much meta on yourself. So, so much meta. Infinite meta. Keep in mind that, even when you attempt to adjust for your own perspective, you will often overestimate other people’s ability to read you, and that, though keeping in mind someone’s read on yourself can be a valuable data point because you know your own alignment, it should be something utilised carefully.

If every single person here who went “your wolfread on me is too bad for you to be town” were correct, Zone would probably be getting quite the talking-to by the mods for fucking up the rand so badly as to have half the game be mafia, even accounting for the wolves who are probably saying it at this point, given it’s been called out explicitly as a towntell. It also just… creates a bad thread environment a lot. All the time. There’s a reason it’s traditionally considered a wolftell to OMGUS.

[PrincessAbigail]

@PrincessAbigail

Town Core

May - I dunno how to explain my feelings here… just like I expect May to play with a certain vibe like wordy, weird takes that I can’t comprehend. I suppose it’s fakable but i’m fine just ignoring that

Cait - I’ve explained this. Cait is a player who I’m prone to being blind to when I’m not cautious that could be happening here but my read isn’t faked it isn’t something I predetermined it isn’t something I’m doing cause we are dating and I feel like I’ve provided enough depth to it for that to be fucking obvious

Arctic - I just like how they’ve responded to everything and I like that they pushed the game forward early the way they did they are a beacon of light even if i hate their conclusions

Garfooled - basically the jokey responses to pressure felt calm and relaxed in a townie way but mostly I’m just pocketed by them being like “guess we’ll see” lol that’s such towny energy

Psy - I dunno how to word this read since it’s so heavily rooted in just the general vibe I feel… but I just feel like the genuineness of their solving and approach to the game is obvious they feel like they are actively trying to figure out alignemt and not pushing any agenda

Luka - frustration with me feels real I’m being unfair to him I think that his approach to Caitlin is townie even if I think it’s wrong. Like if I take a step back.

Reasons

[WindwardAway]

@guavagudetama

Oh do you not have reasons
VOTE: Garfooled
You coulda just said that

Pressure votes. Of course I’m not going to place a vote and loudly announce that I’m pressuring a slot…

[WindwardAway]

@guavagudetama

@WindwardAway

VOTE: guava

Back to here, I guess. Call it OMGUS, call it a hunch. I feel like guava knows better than to call my unexplained votes scummy.

This is actually omgus for once

Yes
But also I don’t currently townread you

[WindwardAway]

@Psyx

WindwardAway - their D1 wasn’t so hot during our game in NUF, so if they continue as is here I hope they’ll post better in D2 & D3 like in that game too

If you play with me more often, you’ll come to realize that my D1 is rarely anything particularly great.

[WindwardAway]

I think my D1 in that NUF game was actually one of my worse D1s as of late, but on the other hand it gave me a much better starting point for solving and I voted correctly on D1 and D3. One of the rare instances I actually do something correct as town, lol.

[WindwardAway]

Not that anyone asked, but since you can see the NUF game since it’s not paywalled like SA, here’s the link:

Mafia - Mysterious Machinations Mafia - Game Over | Town Win

Didn’t realize until now that I hadn’t updated my game links lol

[PrincessAbigail]

@WindwardAway

Pressure votes. Of course I’m not going to place a vote and loudly announce that I’m pressuring a slot…

The amount of people who do that is astonishing

[PrincessAbigail]

@WindwardAway

If you play with me more often, you’ll come to realize that my D1 is rarely anything particularly great.

Is my opinion of you really that skewed? I always thought your d1s were like fine

[PrincessAbigail]

In the interest of fairness I’m gonna respond to this since Luka said I had no defense

@Luka

Content that amounts to nothing. This is making reads to make reads; not because you actually believe it.

I think this is a really unfair interpretation of Caitlins game play and the effectiveness of content in general. Generating content is always good even if it’s forced or fake and in fact you should know this since you’ve in games faked reads on people to generate content weather you realized that you were doing it or not which made other slots readable as well in how they reacted to it.

However even still I do not think it’s fair to assume that Caitlin is just making up reads and I find that these types of “you don’t believe this” reads are rarely effective. I used to say this a lot and kill a lot of townies.

@Luka

Nah, you had progression. But hear me out- wolves also have progression. Im accusing you for intentionally making a poor read in order to further your game plan.

shrugs

@Luka

You’re acting rather confident in them for this to be the case, but thats fair. I wouldn’t know- I just see you acting confident in them. Point taken.

I’d actually like to see where Cait has been confident in her reads at all this game. I guess maybe her scum reads but than not really

@Luka

It was early game and there wasn’t a great reason to sus people?

This actually… really bothers me like what?

You can find wolfs early.

@Luka

Correctness of a push doesn’t equate to how good a push is.

I mean… it kinda does CFTWR is a false thing. If you got caught than… you got caught. Just cause you don’t see it doesn’t mean it’s not there I miss shit all the time

@Luka

Anyways, I posted my reads before you did yours and actually provided valid reasons for them imo, you did it after so id argue mine is a bit better.

Why does the order reads were posted matter at all?

I hate doing this I just feel like I’m playing lawyer when Cait should be defending herself

I won’t do this again I don’t believe it’s beneficial.

shrugs I don’t even know how to play this game anymore

[WindwardAway]

@PrincessAbigail

@WindwardAway

If you play with me more often, you’ll come to realize that my D1 is rarely anything particularly great.

Is my opinion of you really that skewed? I always thought your d1s were like fine

Yeah then you’re in the minority lmao
I usually fuck up during RVS because I don’t know how to not be awkward, regardless of alignment, and then the whole rest of the day goes downhill unless I either blurt something very towny or I let it stew overnight and come up with a solve the next day.

[PrincessAbigail]

@WindwardAway

Yeah then you’re in the minority lmao
I usually fuck up during RVS because I don’t know how to not be awkward, regardless of alignment, and then the whole rest of the day goes downhill unless I either blurt something very towny or I let it stew overnight and come up with a solve the next day.

Intresting…I do remember you getting sussed for awkward early play in a few games but I feel like I always defended you… maybe

I do read games so massively different than other players though

[WindwardAway]

Yeah, that’s probably why, but on the other hand it’s why I like reading your takes, they usually give me another perspective to think about.

[Luka]

@May

It’s not as funny if I win awards anymore. It was really funny when I got awards wihtout having won a single forum mafia game. Now I have like a 40% winrate so I’m just, like, regular below average cringefail. Rather than being a wonderful beautiful flatline of 0 wins

Maybe be worse L take tbh

@WindwardAway

Back to here, I guess. Call it OMGUS, call it a hunch. I feel like guava knows better than to call my unexplained votes scummy.

Why would Guava know better? This seems like a weird half hearted accusation. This could be based on meta tho

@may can you give me somebody to ISO? I should probably re-eval at this point given how the game is going.

@May

I can fake whatever I want

Fake being un-cute rn

@May

Zug is towny and Psy is towny and Gar is towny and lol is towny and guava is towny and Wind is towny and Arctic is town and Abbi is towny and Caitlin is towny and Luka is towny

This is a twonie post

@WindwardAway

Why am I towny, in your opinion?

Fakable but town post; +1 town cred

@WindwardAway

I went back to thinking Luka is townier than not, btw

What made you change your mind?

@May

W + unratio + no agenda + having unmentioned reads + forgetting about those reads & not feeling obligated to provide follow-up + willingness to sound superficially abrasive + admitted you had nothing to add + honestly they’re a bit weaker than most of my other reasons for townreading people + and mostly come from individual things that can be easily faked if one has the experience to know they seem towny + overall i’d call it a nulltown read + and honestly being nulltown is the most suspicious thing you can be + but I said I wouldn’t think about the game + I shouldn’t be idling my vote on Gar like I am though + VOTE: WindwardAway + yes Maydens + bye chat

W townie.

@May

Explanation of this vote that’s not in L + ratio format:

Copying this since its simpler; this read feels fairly townie / organic. I dont really have much to add but I wanted to say i can agree with tihs.

@WindwardAway

Also, yeah, what I’m doing is entirely intentional, I’m not gonna deny it

And then they say this, which is another town tell.

@PrincessAbigail

This… is literally… how Cait gets when she feels behind… constantly

Fine

@PrincessAbigail

Yeah… maybe Luka since I think I’m being unfair there but I dunno clear my head come back

Townie progression, show’s re-eval.

@guavagudetama

Am I dumb or is this everyone in the game other than yourself

It is yes. Everybody is being townie / town telling sobbing.

@May

(Yeah, this is me complaining about not having an early wolfread)

I love complaining

@Psyx

• Luka - still no wolf pings and their tone consistently sounds towny. I admit I haven’t been paying close attention to their posts after that early townlean tho; +1 ISO homework

Please do ISO me. This is a bit greedy of me but I like people giving reads on me lol.

@WindwardAway

Pressure votes. Of course I’m not going to place a vote and loudly announce that I’m pressuring a slot…

I do :3

@PrincessAbigail

I think this is a really unfair interpretation of Caitlins game play and the effectiveness of content in general. Generating content is always good even if it’s forced or fake and in fact you should know this since you’ve in games faked reads on people to generate content weather you realized that you were doing it or not which made other slots readable as well in how they reacted to it.

I admited in my wall post that I was kind of seeing that in a negative light when I shouldnt. I feel the more apt way to say would it it felt feigned; I normally tr content early but in this case it was around 30 seconds in and it seemed to be moe confident tham caitlin said it was.

@PrincessAbigail

I’d actually like to see where Cait has been confident in her reads at all this game. I guess maybe her scum reads but than not really

Scum reads, as said.

@PrincessAbigail

You can find wolfs early.

There wasn’t a great reason though lol. I’m not denying that.

@PrincessAbigail

I mean… it kinda does CFTWR is a false thing. If you got caught than… you got caught. Just cause you don’t see it doesn’t mean it’s not there I miss shit all the time

I have bias towards this since, mostly in games like tos, I get pushed a ton for false reasons imo and it annoys me(IE: Leading town). But I do 100% think somebody can have false reasons for a push, mostly meta.

@PrincessAbigail

Why does the order reads were posted matter at all?

Doesn’t really, juust shows that im not copying cait.

[May]

@Luka

@May

I can fake whatever I want

Fake being un-cute rn

FUCK

[May]

Thats not cute right saying the fuck word isnt cute ?

[Luka]

@May

Thats not cute right saying the fuck word isnt cute ?

Yet somehow you manage to make it

[May]

God fucking damnit I can never win around here

[PrincessAbigail]

@WindwardAway

Yeah, that’s probably why, but on the other hand it’s why I like reading your takes, they usually give me another perspective to think about.

Aww thank you so much