yea
dreamer, artist, fortune teller, snake charmer, gossip, and the like can differentiate between goblin and demon
engineer, courtier, preacher etc can all block the goblin’s ability
2 Likes
Also a more extreme example but
The Heretic can make Goblin lose the game for evil instead
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Hm… If Heretic is possibly in the game, then it is probably best to get a Minion to claim Goblin first to test the waters rather than having the actual Goblin (if they are indeed in the game) claim immediately. Because then Demon can kill Heretic, and otherwise if Villagers decide to trust in both claims of Heretic and Goblin (and both are legitimate), then Villager just wins immediately.
The issue is that Villager would have to trust both claims though, because if Minion/Demon claims Heretic while there is actually no Heretic in the game, then uh… RIP Villagers.
2 Likes
if goblin claims goblin that day and then gets executed, the goblin wins
botc runs off a one for all zero-sum mechanic where if one person wins or loses, their entire team does the same, and the other team endures the opposite
it is also a minion role and therefore will always start the game evil
and anyone who’s putting alignment changing mechanics in a game with goblin is already absolutely mad
3 Likes
putting an alignment changing mechanic that can swap evil to good is also absolutely mad
Alchemist Goblin, on the other hand
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this is entirely intentional
players are supposed to utterly doubt any claim that exists in one way or another
a town fakeclaiming heretic can lose the game for evils in an instant when the demon kills theirself to trigger flagbearer just as easily as the demon fakeclaiming atheist can lose the game in an instant because if the storyteller is executed in a non atheist game, good loses
ever so onwards
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honestly Alchemist Goblin isn’t nearly as strong as it’s cracked out to be
1 Like
true
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Maybe not until you rand Alchemist Goblin in a game with players willing to YOLO rerack D1 on your claim.
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Alchemist Goblin still wins if they are executed in F3. Good wins ties and that means if you believe the Alch Goblin as good, you have a 2/3 chance of making the game winning execution.
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PROOF that jesters are fun and fair and balanced
6 Likes
Solid Darkest Dungeon class. A great intro move with Finale into one of the best stress healers in the game. I give him a solid 4 Reynaulds out of a possible 5.
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+1
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its probably a lot stronger on forum because good can clear others a lot more confidently and evil don’t have the benefit of realtime hesitance/chaos to openwolf vote against it
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I think that’s why I did Alch Fearmonger over Alch Goblin that one time
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Extrapolating this case to all cases, Jester is only fun when YBW plays as one. Therefore any setup which includes a jester must also include YBW to forcibly rand into it.
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Huh. To my surprise, enough people are actually willing to play with Jesters that leave upon reaching victory.
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it’s a cycle
people think they’re fine until they actually have to play with them in a FM context
then their minds change
repeat ad infinitum
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Well, at least the majority of this community agrees that Game-Ending Jesters are a bad idea.
As for the other Jester: We can check how many of them will actually join a game with that kind of Jesters. I am planning to eventually host Jester Cult Overhaul FM.
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it is possible to make a game with Jesters in which context they aren’t completely trash
but that’s only if you specifically design the entire game such that they’re a focal point
which is really kinda outside the scope of the question as posed imo
1 Like