Bland & Flavorless Mountainous 15er - Mafia Winnered

[Prisma101]

Your basically grasping at straws and giving absolutes that aren’t actually so absolute

[Arctic]

i. would like to become the king

[Arctic]

sheep m today and if im wrong kill me tomorrow

[Arctic]

even if you think im a wolf you can agree to this

[Arctic]

wont you shake a poor sinners hand

[Arctic]

why is my title a cake

[Arete]

@Jarek

@Arete

raises hand

I disagree

Okay this is good, why? What has Prisma done in your mind that proves to you they are in fact town? Is it purely the newbie stuff? I personally do not wish to clear someone for that alone any more.

• a lot of their posts, particularly today, have felt like they genuinely wanted to prove themself as town by flipping/expect that their flip will vindicate them. relevant quotes:

@Prisma101

and lastly if in any case i do die today and i am in fact town (no matter how much i say it zorvo will only want it to be fully seen when i die) i want zorvo voted out by the end of day 5

@Prisma101

Vote me but in doing so you are making a mistake as I can guarantee you I am town

@Prisma101

Idfk but if I am executed today I want you dead by tomorrow

@Prisma101

All that will do is prove zorvo is wrong and ofc i dont get the satisfaction of either dying by mafia or winning this game but all rhat i ask is if i am voted out I highly suggest you vote zorvo out for his baseless reads (which I admit is a baseless reason to vote him out)

@Prisma101

If i am voted out because of zorvos reasons against me (not voting arete and ignoring his wall post for one example) then vote him out d5 for the reason that all proof he has provided on people is dumb (like clearing you literally just because you sheeped him)

@Prisma101

Well actually its not defeatist its me saying im willing to die to prove zorvo is wrong about his statement that all his reads are right

• when I’ve tried poking at their reads, I’m not going to say that their thought process was sound, but I think it was real. relevant quotes:

@Prisma101

@mollylikesorigami

they seem barely conscious of the fact that town wins by killing wolves.

I know thats how we are meant to win but i cant provide good enough proof against someone and if i agree with someones reads i don’t know how to explain why and everyone still continues to ask even after i say I don’t know and give as much reason as i can

@Prisma101

@May

My thoughts on Otter are I don’t really know how to read her in this format. I have enough trouble reading her in a Discord format (last game we played together I went back and forth and back and forth, convincing myself she as both certainly town and scum at different points in the endgame).

May says they have played before so we can use that to better read otter

@May

but that could equally be the result of a wolf not wanting to make subjective calls or a townie in an unfamiliar environment

They also give reason as to why it could be wolfy or towny due to it being their first time on the site

P.s. I probably explained it horribly

@Arete

can you elaborate more on why you think May saying those things makes them more likely to be town? I’m trying to understand your thought process

it’s okay if your reasons feel ‘silly,’ or if you aren’t sure about something, just try to explain what you’re thinking as honestly as you can

@Prisma101

Idk how else to explain it

@Arogame123

And while we are on that topic, if you had to lean Arete one way or another, what’s your feeling about Arete? Likelier to be town or mafia?

@Prisma101

i dunno ig neutral but i dont think thats an option

• some of their early concern about not looking sus was kind of “pure”/not something I would expect a wolf to double down on in thread

@Prisma101

@Arogame123

So if you had the opportunity to kill someone today, it would be Zorvo or Otter?

Im not sure

I voted zorvo and if I change to vote otter that will give zorvo more reason to suspect me

@Prisma101

Because in every “we must vote out one of these people” i have been an option and since otter has a lot of votes if i change now or even later to vote otter it will look like im just trying to get rid of as many people as possible

I plan to change my vote if anything says otter is mafia more than what has been provided

@Prisma101

Because zorvo doesn’t have a lot of reasons im a wolf and if he finds more then he can make you all vote me despite me not being wolf

• I kinda think that if they were a wolf they would give up on the Zorvo push by now, it’s pretty clear no one is going to listen – feels more like something they actually believe in than something they’re pursuing opportunistically (tbc this is a weaker point)
• I think them expecting to die overnight was real/not made up
• the reasons to suspect them mostly kind of suck and if they were a wolf there would be better reasons (this is not really something I believe)

[Arete]

@Zorvo

@Marluxion
If you don’t see how obvious it is that Prisma, Arete and Arctic are the wolf team idk what to tell yeah.

hey @Zorvo if you’re 100% confident I’m a wolf you should definitely be willing to agree to this offer, right?

@Arete

@Zorvo

I don’t appreciate the discredit on me.

how about this, I’m happy to offer you a deal

I will stop discrediting your reads solely on the basis of coming from you (not for other reasons, like I can still discredit them for having bad arguments) for the rest of the game

in exchange, if we’re both villagers, you have to never argue that your reads are inherently better than other people’s, or accuse people of not listening to you just because of who you are, or ignore people who raise valid reasons to disagree with you, or act like you have a specially unusually good intuition/gut, in all future games where you are town

(under forum rules this is completely unenforceable, but you can still agree to do it – it’s just not meaningfully binding in any sense)

do we have an agreement?

[May]

I am starting to come around on Prisma, for the record, but I can’t really… develop alternate theories, for various reasons, most of which relate to the reason I can’t get out of bed right now. I’m not sure Prisma is the best execution at this point, and I think Zorvo’s doing the thing he often does where he settles for a “guaranteed wolf” execution that lies on the fringes of his solve rather than the central components that provide its support. Like Eliza in GOAT^2, like Eliza yesterday.

[Arete]

@Arctic

sheep m today and if im wrong kill me tomorrow

on who

you aren’t even voting

@Arctic

why is my title a cake

happy FoL anniversary

[May]

I wish we could set more things as [non-custom] titles, by the way. I was trying to set my title as “Read Guidelines”

[Arete]

I bet if you ask Chloe really nicely after the game she’ll change it so you can

[May]

Awesome. I can show off to the whole world how many guidelines I read

[Arete]

here are some Miscellaneous Disconnected Thoughts floating around my head before I go to bed

• I feel like I keep trying to metaphorically throw Arctic a rope to pull himself out of the metaphorical hole of not being very invested in the game and he keeps looking at the rope, looking at me, and being like “I don’t NEED rope. I can get myself out of here MYSELF.” and then not climbing out of the hole. (this should be taken as shade)
• Lemon brought up her Isos as a reason to townread her earlier and I … don’t think it is? like ‘faking an Iso’ is not the part of wolfing that is hard, ‘she did Isos’ is not even the best reason to townread Lemon, etc.
• regardless of his alignment Marl ~knows I’m town (this isn’t a TMI accusation)
• my brain has decided the team might be Lemon/May/Arctic. I have zero idea if it makes sense and am mostly just saying it for that <does some math> 1.79% chance of postgame credit but there are ways in which it associatively makes sense (this does not mean it is a good team)
• there is part of me that vaguely feels like this game makes more sense if I’m pulling a spec-chat-invitational-with-Twice but I … don’t actually think either Zorvo or Jarek is a wolf? which of course I didn’t, and wouldn’t, but ‘mrrr lots of people are kind of townie’ is not super helpful.
• Arctic [otterpod] Prisma Arete Zorvo [Aro] molly [Vulgard] Marluxion - these are the people who have literally ever voted the top wagon at EoD. Leaves Jarek May Lemonfairy. Lemonfairy has voted the primary counterwagon twice, Jarek May have each voted it once – but if I’m looking totally in a vacuum I do think that ‘literally never voted the top wagon’ is a >rand wolf position to be in. (help I’m confbiasing)
• confbias team does make that EoD2 look really weird, like under Confbias Team you’ve got Arctic selfpressing, no other wolves on Eliza, one wolf bussing one wolf not voting which is just sorta. really.
• Day 1 wagons were v/v - [Magnus] Phraze/Marl [Eliza] Jarek May [Aleph/Vulgard] are not voting one of the two Main Wagons.
• if you all had just said “okay yes sure we will go with Option 1, let’s vote Arete” instead of lying to yourselves about how you’re Totally Capable Of Meaningful Reevaluation In This Gamestate today would’ve been 100000x more productive.

[Marluxion]

@Arete

• regardless of his alignment Marl ~knows I’m town (this isn’t a TMI accusation)

i absolutely do not and if i did this would be the easiest day in the world

we would just kill seth

[Marluxion]

@Prisma101

Can we just address how much zorvo declares we lose and mafia wins? Its nowhere near that atm

if we miseliminate someone today the game effectively becomes unwinnable
i have seen exactly 1 final 7 comeback from town in my many years playing this game
if we dont miselim we are a lot closer to 25% to 33% which isnt that horrible but still

[Marluxion]

you realize you dont have to ping me 85 times for me to read the thread right
and pinging me isn’t going to make me get to your message any faster

[Marluxion]

no

[Arete]

search your heart

you’re mad at me for perceived-gamethrowing for a reason

also I already explained why we’re not killing Seth

[Marluxion]

so who are we killing that leads to town actually winning