Yeah basically what I was imagining was town noexeing into a crosskill but I forgot that that would still end the game
if scum had popped Sultan’s vest earlier then town still could have won by noexeing
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no
mafia would win if they killed sultan at jight
sultan hadn’t infected everyone yet
he could shoot scum though (if he’d infected everyone. which he hadn’t)
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basically what I’m saying is that if multiple things had been different town could have won
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Basically roles should have agency in them and everyone should feel like they’re playing the game they expected to play.
SK-like neutrals are kind of on the line in this regard and IMO should be announced so that “you might play as/against neutral parties” is part of the expectation of the game - so when all the wolves die, town doesn’t keep chopping into people partnered with them to look for another one, so that wolves don’t all out themselves to hammer the last villager and discover they still haven’t won, and so people who fucking hate playing neutral roles don’t sign up for the game and experience misery.
More… game-perpendicular or against-game neutrals are Questionable design space to me the more you get away from mafia, and heavily depend on site culture - on whether your players expect to and presumably enjoy playing these little Mario Party minigames instead of mafia. And the weirder your wincons get, the more often it feels not only like you’re playing a different game, but that you’re playing a game of Not Mafia Skill. Of luck, or of skill at something else.
You gotta read the room.
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me after the mafier game is joever
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Anyway that’s an unrelated tangent and it’s not even very insightful the observations are pretty basic. Sad! Well theres other tangents. Hey Zug what’s the best wrongboy post we made .What’s the one where we can circle and put a clickbait arrow to the username and be like WRONGBOY LOL
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in more serious discussion, this is also a Good Post
like, there are lots of things that we’re never going to consider to be Bastard that you still shouldn’t do 
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no there are better ones
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Bomber moment
Wrongboy!
(We weren’t serious about htis one there’s gotta be better)
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Lyingboy!
That game sounds ancient.
i was thinking this might be wrong but it’s actually good
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summer/fall 2019, yeah
nearly five years ago. jesus christ
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Also Zug looking back your reads this game were scary good and I apologise for not picking up on Kiiruma’s clear being bullshit when you did :joycat: I feel like me accepting it unquestioningly early on was bad for both of us
STOP BEING CORRECTBOY ZUG
no that’s also my fault
I thought it was bs for a bit and then got convinced otherwise