Happy Tree Friends FM - Game Thread Night 3 13/20

[WindwardAway]

@Vulgard

I’ve read Beancat’s defense of Leafia again and I flip-flopped on what it means for his alignment, but I think it makes him town. It could be a TMI defense, but for someone in Beancat’s position I don’t think it’s worth it. He has 13 posts at the moment and his defense of Leafia forms the majority of his real content, I don’t see why “Leafia is V” would be his sole hill to die on as mafia (and this is regardless of Leafia’s alignment).

Vulgard said something similar to what I thought about beancat

@Vulgard

@Host_Account_2

|Vulgard|Leafia, Beancat, Zorvo|3/11

Why is it always the people I suspect that wagon me…

…and then backtracks it? Or maybe he just beat Leafia and Zorvo, idk

@Vulgard

I’m honestly not sure why she’s townreading him myself. He called her a wolf, after all. So far, Leafia’s been complaining about everyone calling her a wolf, and Illwei’s wolfread on her is the crux of her wolfread on Illwei. Yet, Leafia made an exception for Marl, and I’m not sure why that is.

More musings

I did have a thought earlier that Leafia could purposely avoid interacting with her partners in order not to spew them as her partners. She’s doubtlessly aware of her reputation as a wolf who TMIs her entire team, and so her attempt to fix it could just be “I won’t talk about them, at most I’ll slap a read on them and move on.” It’d fit her treatment of Marl.

Making reads like this is a bit stupid, because Leafia might be a villager - in which case I can toss all that out of the window. But if she is a wolf, it might be worth considering.

Vulgard questions why Leafia treats Marl differently from Illwei.

@Vulgard

/vote Marluxion @Host_Account_2

I find Achro’s case convincing.

I knew I said I’d peace out until EoD but I feel I need to change my vote here

Vul wouldn’t try to bus Marl so early after theorizing that Leafia is TMIing Marl as town, I don’t think. So Vul probably town?

@Vulgard

I forgot to say this before, but I think Marl/Wind aren’t W/W either. It’s not even just because Marl pushed on Wind, but because of how Wind reacted to the push. It was mostly dismissive and made me think they weren’t doing theater

I take it he’s retracted this lol

@Vulgard

It’s probably a bad sign that I’m reading Alice’s ISO and I find all her takes questionable.

@Vulgard do you find that Alice has improved since when you posted this?

@Vulgard

@Alice

What do you two think about Marl’s ret claim?

I think it’s too early to have come from a wolf. It came many hours away from EoD1, so it’s not like he was desperate and begging for survival. The claim doesn’t even buy him much survival in the first place, because he’ll get yeeted if he doesn’t revive. Which he can’t, if he’s mafia.

In summary, I think that as a wolf, Marl would’ve either claimed later or not at all.

As for whether he would’ve claimed as town - I do have a reason to think that he would have. The problem is that I’m not sure whether I should say it.

Still catching up.

/vote eevee @Host_Account_2

@Alice

Achro/Vul went to Marl, Illwei self-voted, and Wazza is still on Leafia.

Most of the reasoning basically boils down to Marl’s claim being sketchy, tbfh.

I didn’t vote Marl because of his claim being sketchy, I voted Marl because I sheeped Achro’s case on him. A major point of Achro’s case on Marl was that he was TMIng Achro V in their interactions. I read them myself and I agreed at the time, so I voted for Marl. I’m pretty sure he claimed after I voted him, but I don’t remember for sure.

Meh

Don’t like the part about claiming, for obvious reasons

@Vulgard

@Marluxion

ok since eevee is pulling a gambit i’m going to make sure it doesn’t pay off since i basically always die here anyway

I’m mafia

Okay, I unironically think the Marl wagon was pure at its peak if that’s how he felt about the situation. I really didn’t think he’d feel that way, but here we are.

This reminds me I should probably go back and look at wagonomics

@Vulgard

I don’t think Marl ever claims there as mafia unless he’s getting voted by a lot of villagers.

@Host_Account_2

|Marl|Hippo, WindwardAway, Atlas, Vulgard, Leafia, Achromatic|6/11

So, I’m clearing this entire group. The worst vote here is actually Hippo’s because it looks the best which makes it the most likely to come from a bussing wolf, but at the very least I don’t want to go after the other five. And I still think Hippo isn’t necessarily a bussing wolf, so let’s not.

I’m not going to vote Marl because I must vote the claimed 3p on principle.

Again, Vulgard sort of went back on part of this in his SoD readlist today

@Vulgard

I also think Marl outing himself points toward my reading of the game (highposters being generally town) being pretty good, because I think that if he had some louder partners he would not have claimed, expecting them to save him

I think it indicates the opposite
There’s at least one deeper wolf in this game, and it’s probably Vulgard or Alice if I had to pick names off the top of my head
Cause it ain’t me

The thing that gets me is that I agree with a good number of Vulgard’s takes, but I feel like this happened in Gold Rush where he was a wolf and I was town, and literally no one except maybe clonedcheese wanted to push him with me, and I don’t even think we pushed Vulgard at the same time lol.
Anyway my point is that I do acknowledge I tend to mindmeld with Vulgard when he’s a wolf, and idk if that says more about his wolf play or my town play so I’m not clearing him off agreeing with his takes.
Im just debating whether him voting Marl because he liked Achro’s case is clearing enough, or if that doesn’t indicate anything because he moved off of Marl for the ret claim, and then after that it didn’t matter because Marl openwolfed and destroyed any sort of spew we would normally have gotten at EoD.

[WindwardAway]

Note that if it turns out Brad is a wolf, I will probably clear Vulgard

[WindwardAway]

Will look at Brad next, be back later

[Alice]

Right, so what do you think about Hippo linking Marl to Leafia d1?

[Alice]

Wait, did Brad wolfread anyone this game?

[Alice]

Yh, just checked his ISO. That’s another major cause for concern. Last time I’ve wolfed with him he had trouble pushing people and he basically had no suspicions this entire game and had no votes for the entirety of d1.

More certain on Brad/Hippo, tbh.

[Vulgard]

@WindwardAway

Im just debating whether him voting Marl because he liked Achro’s case is clearing enough, or if that doesn’t indicate anything because he moved off of Marl for the ret claim,

I unironically overestimated Marl’s wolfgame
Sorry Marl

Yeah I’ve changed my mind on a lot of things since day 1
I’ll need to check you/Marl interactions again because that part is something that might actually still hold true

[Alice]

WWA did claim a PR earlier and I don’t think a wolf in her position would make a claim like that, tbh.

[Vulgard]

@Alice

Right, so what do you think about Hippo linking Marl to Leafia d1?

His takes have been sort of wtf this entire game and there was also the part when he claimed Sheriff as a meme so frankly idk what he’s doing

[Vulgard]

I sort of don’t think Hippo/Leafia are paired

[Zone_Q11]

@Gorta

ok, and if you are scum then they see you killing eevee, so you get instant town cred?

No. It’s the opposite: I claimed Insane, so if anyone sees me visiting eevee, then they could (and probably should tbh) redcheck me for lying.

@Gorta

I just want you to understand why I think you are bad, as you seem to be in complete disbelief over my reasoning. You are basically trying to justify everything I scum read you for. The question is “Why?”?

Read this:

@Zone_Q11

Beef because it’s not even clear logic.

I can take on any shading or incorrect scumreads any time-- as long as their reasoning is sound.

“My behavior does not match my town meta”?
Fine. I can’t prove shit anyway when your argument relies on your own experiences.

“My role and actions cannot be proven”?
Fine. I literally can’t move anyway, so I might as well keel over and die if this is your sole reason to put me on the spotlight as scapegoat.

But his reason was just “that’s what mafia would say”, without any further backup arguments. This is such as weak argument that I would’ve shot him if I was an actual Vig, and not regret if he is somehow town.

The most frustrating thing is: I don’t even know whether he is BS’ing as Mafia, or actually using a BS logic to scumread me.

[WindwardAway]

@BradLand

Okayyyyy not backreading because I don’t have time.

See that Marl is top wagon. Not really gonna fight it because I don’t have a more confident scumread that I’d want to pushf or.

Still wanna know the reasoning for it.

Here’s Brad’s reason for not defending Marl, and just two posts up in his ISO he’s fighting Achro hard on the Illwei read.

…yeah, actually, Brad can die.

[Alice]

Current wolfteam pitch?

[WindwardAway]

Like
He townleans Marl and doesn’t have a more confident scumread to push for, but also doesn’t even bother to defend Marl or give reasons why he’s town

I think Vulgard is right

[WindwardAway]

/vote Bradland @Host_Account_2

[Vulgard]

@Vulgard

I sort of don’t think Hippo/Leafia are paired

Mostly because I still think the “one wolf at most on Marl’s wagon at its peak” read is still legit

[Vulgard]

I’m referring to the time before he outed himself as mafia btw

[WindwardAway]

@Alice

Wait, did Brad wolfread anyone this game?

He did not

[WindwardAway]

Yeah, his slot was still redeemable at that point and unless there’s a bus-happy wolf on the team, I don’t think they would’ve tried to bus him. It was fairly early in the day and everyone knows that wagons tend to shift wildly before EoD.

[Alice]

See above, more certain on the Brad/Hippo team now.

Only uncertainty for me is basically the third one as if it’s not Plague then it’s someone who got miscleared.

Though looking back I don’t think we should take Marl’s 4-wolf claim literally as he could’ve lied and made us look for a SK instead of a 5th wolf.