Last poster before threadlock gets a cookie (cookie thread (Part 7)) (Part 8)

General
#29455

theres a difference between “throwing the game” and advancing your wincon in a different way. Im not saying “oh, how dare people choose to make these things that are ‘optimal’ for their win condition!”

Mafia is not that empty shooter. Mafia has so many different abilities you can find, mafia has so many different ideas you can implement, the inherent social aspect of mafia adds so much to it. Mafia itself is a playground and I think players have the oppurtunity to do whatever they want in that playground, or they can like go down the slide for the 50th time

1 Like
#29456

i get this a lot whenever I try to debate about stuff like town of salem I actually get you

2 Likes
#29457

Town of Salem us like that because the optimal moves are too optimal

#29458

Taking what Zug did with Ash’s role as an example: the original role had zero incentive to design a good puzzle, and anybody with the role who deisgned a good, difficult puzzle would probably be begrudged by the other players for hindering their win condition.

By adding a counter to the role that may or may not be in the game and which does incentivise making a good puzzle, the role now can both sincerely try to win and do something fun! Zug’s role doesn’t even have to be in the game for this to happen!

This doesn’t ruin the original role at all, it just transforms the incentive to be in favor of actually making a good puzzle. You have to do that

2 Likes
#29459

That honestly sounds kinda funny though

:wowee:

1 Like
#29460

Mountainous is kind of that empty shooter. Like I’m really struggling to think of a good mountainous wish that doesn’t involve alignment checks or killing

1 Like
#29461

Not for long

#29462

And tbc, the slide is really good! But in a game where im letting you choose to go play on the swings, or the monkey bars, or the carousel that got removed but you can play on it RIGHT NOW, i personally dont follow why youd go on the slide

1 Like
#29463

I mean yes but that’s not the point - I have actively been told that I shouldn’t try to balance the game because apparently it makes it too tryhardy

2 Likes
#29464

Create some complex bullshit that is secretly rigged in your favor

#29465

The only thing I can think of is transform-the-whole-game stuff like “give people roles” and stuff, but that’s really hard to do from a blank slate, you’re basically asking your players to make the whole setup for you which you can’t really expect people to do when “asking for an alignment check” is right htere

1 Like
#29466

Oh fair

#29467

make someone do something really long midgame so they can’t play as much.

5 Likes
#29468

Mountainous sounds fun. Even better is the flipless infinite treestump mafia flagbearer game.

1 Like
#29469

ITALY.

1 Like
#29470

Ok fair

#29471

That’s an Obviously Stupid Unreasonable idea

2 Likes
#29472

I just wanna create a bunch of building neighborhoods with little sub-mechanics and then throw in a minor clause that chain reacts into a great advantage for me

#29473

i don’t think that a genie game is ever gonna be a game for optimising the victory and more of just doing dumb things. it’s not some people’s cup of tea but it has a place

2 Likes
#29474

Like you need stuff to interact with.

This was also Dorian Gray’s big failing IMO. If you place heavy restrictions on people’s abilities, that in turn makes it harder to think of abilities which interact with others. Even if I did succeed with my figure-out-other-people’s-wishes attempt, I wouldn’t have learned anything useful, because nobody else did anything useful either

1 Like