Stratagem-15 FM - MAFIA VICTORY

[PrincessAbigail]

@Luka

How can one mortal be so wrong
Can you explain zug?

No cause I’m no longer confident

[PrincessAbigail]

@Arctic

I don’t really understand why you’ve moved me down
For claiming to do something that I did in fact do on day 1? For explaining why I can see that there is wolf motivation to do what lol is doing, even though I do actually believe he’s town for it? Why is this wolfy?

I am not compelled to town read you. Ergo as far as I’m concerned you’re scum

The end.

[PrincessAbigail]

@Luka

sheep them

Oh.

No.

[Arctic]

@Psyx

Instead they chose the MU game (even if it was more recent) where I subbed out before D1 ended.

I liked the games where you subbed out because it meant I got a small sample and didn’t have the dredge through an entire games worth of posts

@Psyx

For someone who is not very familiar with me (and bound to get my meta wrong), their motive of choosing to metaread me — instead of, yanno, reading what I’ve actually done or said in this game — is questionable.

This… does not make any sense
I am not familiar with your meta, so I chose to become more familiar with your meta by asking you for games to read
I’ve read what you said in this game but I wanted to see if you were capable of making posts like here as a wolf, which I think you are

@Luka

@PrincessAbigail

God your so town and I fucking love it.

Lol why? That post was one of the townier posts they have in there ISO, but they’re by no means locked town. Pocket attempt spotted.

is this a serious read?

@PrincessAbigail

if he was getting run up when he outted it people like Zug and Arctic would be like this isn’t real kill kill kill

if you think i was trying to push lol then you were not reading my posts properly

[Host_Account_5]

Votecount as of P#2124

Garfooled (2): Luka, WindwardAway
Psyx (2): May, Arctic
Arctic (2): Psyx, lol

Not Voting (3): Garfooled, Zugzwang, PrincessAbigail

[Arctic]

what happened to your prior reasons

[PrincessAbigail]

@Arctic

if you think i was trying to push lol then you were not reading my posts properly

Well frankly I don’t think you were trying to do much of anything which is my main problem with you right now

Every stance you have is middling every thing you talk about is middling.

I read something from a very good player once about how mafia is very simple

If someone is trying to convince you someone is town that’s towny

If someone is trying to convince you someone is scum that’s towny unless the person they are pushing is towny than that’s scummy

If someone is trying to imply something without convincing you of it that’s scummy

How does this apply here

Mainly because every thing I recall from you this game is that last point. You SAY you weren’t trying to push Lol she your right you weren’t trying to push him but what you did was worded posts in a way to make him look like a wolf without SAYING he was a wolf and Arctic that’s fucking wolfy shit

[Psyx]

@Arctic

I liked the games where you subbed out because it meant I got a small sample and didn’t have the dredge through an entire games worth of posts

That’s fair, but if it were me I’d choose samples that exclude as much external variable as possible (ie site meta clash, familiarity with players).

@Arctic

This… does not make any sense
I am not familiar with your meta, so I chose to become more familiar with your meta by asking you for games to read
I’ve read what you said in this game but I wanted to see if you were capable of making posts like here as a wolf, which I think you are

I’m not saying you can’t check someone’s past games for their wolfrange, but my problem with your metacase is that you got my meta completely wrong and used that to wolfread me.

[PrincessAbigail]

@Arctic

what happened to your prior reasons

It’s day 2 they no longer hold up especially when the main one (driving the game forward) has ceased to exist. Your not doing that anymore. Now I don’t want to push you because you are apparently busy and I refuse to push you for an activity based read like that if your busy but I also can’t continue to town read you for something so weak that also just no longer applies

I force a town core D1 some of them prove themselves towny and I never rescind my read

Some I reeval

D2 is when I cement the core it’s the day where things change the most.

[WindwardAway]

@Luka

@WindwardAway

Only thing is that most of his posts quoting me and calling me wolfy were literally just that: bare bones, said I was wolfy because my posts were wolfy, not a huge amount of explanation there. On the one hand, good that he didn’t overjustify it? On the other hand, it felt a bit lackluster.

Im not great at explaining super well but(presuming this is d1) I thought your posts were wolfy since tmk youre a good player. Ive read the FOL nominations thread specifically, and tmk you were the one they sent to MU. I dont think town would do what you were doing without an agenda(which you clearly did have), and town having an agenda is rarer than wolves. Wolves meanwhile would do it to get town read, especially a player as experienced / good as you.

This actually makes sense, thanks

[Arctic]

@PrincessAbigail

Mainly because every thing I recall from you this game is that last point. You SAY you weren’t trying to push Lol she your right you weren’t trying to push him but what you did was worded posts in a way to make him look like a wolf without SAYING he was a wolf and Arctic that’s fucking wolfy shit

read my post

@Arctic

@WindwardAway

lol happens to have very convincingly claimed cop and you’re still on him like you want to dig up reasons to get him out

It wasn’t convincing imo

Also, if you think about it, there’s not town motivation to claim cop here - if he’s actual cop, he’s outting as the IC on day 2 for no reason when wolves wouldn’t have known he was the cop, and if he’s VT then, unless wolves happened to target exactly him with the vanillizer, then wolves will know he isn’tt the cop and so he won’t eat the nightkill or anything, and will just get cc’ed later, as well as causing a bunch of people to spew themselves as VT. So I think the level 1 read is that this is actually wolfy from lol, and I don’t really think it’s wolfy to push him for these reasons

And despite all of this, I do actually agree with you, I don’t think lol does this as a wolf, because it just gives him attention for no reason and he get’s cc’ed today or later on and gets policied or something, I think he’s probably town just fucking around trying to eat the NK or something and doesn’t understand the setup means that he can’t trick the wolves lol. but playing devil’s advocate I can see why zug thinks it’s wolfy

The intention of my post was to explain why I didn’t think zug was wolfy for pushing lol, because I can see why a villager would think lol was wolfy for his claim, but I very clearly state that I think lol is a villager. You are heavily misinterpreting my actions or not reading me in good faith

[PrincessAbigail]

@Arctic

read my post

I have read it

[Arctic]

@Psyx

I’m not saying you can’t check someone’s past games for their wolfrange, but my problem with your metacase is that you got my meta completely wrong and used that to wolfread me.

describe your town and wolf meta to me then

[WindwardAway]

I’m still flipflopping on zug
Cause Arctic is right, Zug’s reaction to lol’s claim isn’t actually wolfy
But Zug is still in the list of “least towny players in the game” so idk

[Arctic]

I disagree, I think he’s my top town and I’m confused as to how people don’t see what I’m seeing

• The way he handled pressure (specifically from May and Abbi, read as though he’s genuinely trying to gauge the alignments of those suspecting him rather than trying to defend himself)
• The push on Psyx for the wording was mega towny and felt believable given how long he kept it up for
• Being hesitant to vote guava (a villager) despite the only other alternative at eod being himself
• Handling of Garfooled today wrt the slip
• The read on lol/gar being w/w for the pfp change thing (lmao)

This:

@Zugzwang

ok atp I can’t ask more without outing it, and Abbi has seemed to answer “no she doesn’t”

so
Psyx is probably town for saying “I had a lightbulb moment”. It’s not wording that comes naturally unless you either:

a) use it frequently (she doesn’t)
or
b) actually had a lightbulb moment (and are therefore town)

I initially said it would be scummy to not have said it, so that she wouldn’t lie about not doing it.

@Zugzwang

ok I have went through Abbi’s ISO writing the wolfcase… and in the process started TRing her

I also just townread the random stream of consciousness / insane posting they’ve done several times this game, and I’m not sure they would be comfortable doing this as well as openwolfing in what they’re claiming would be their first wolf rand in 3 years

[WindwardAway]

Tbf I never fully backread D1 but that post on Psyx is pretty good

[WindwardAway]

Not sure whether to give credit to the Abbi post cause that’s the sort of post that I’d make as a wolf, but yeah you have a point about the wagons yesterday too, I did consider that earlier

[WindwardAway]

Why are there such split opinions on Garfooled, though? Seems like people either strongly TR them or strongly SR them, and tbh the people who TR them seem to have better reasons while the people SRing them are like me, mostly going “yeah this is poe because there’s not enough there” which I’ll admit is kinda unfair.

[WindwardAway]

But in that case we’d have at least one, if not two, pretty good wolves.

[WindwardAway]

For some reason I still don’t have much of an opinion either way on May and I should probably read their posts to make a call